Hello. Christina here, I'm trying something new. I'm going to be sharing some of my favorite, juiciest episodes of the JOMOcast from the last three years. And I'm kicking it off with one of my favorite all-time episodes, the Joy of Missing Out on Loneliness with Salimah Ebrahim who coincidentally, I am actually getting together with, in person tonight to do letter writing.

We have started a little monthly letter writing get together the two of us. Hope to be expanding and making that public in the very near future. But what I love about Salimah is her career has had such an incredible arc from being a young environmental stewardship advocate to launching tech startups, to being a journalist in war zones.

She is such a brave and courageous human being. And what drives her is love. What drives her is connection. What drives her is a desire for people to know and understand one another better. So I hope you enjoy this first of a series of reruns from the JOMOcast. My top favorite episodes of all time. Give it a listen.

Christina:

My name is Christina Crook, and I am the author of The Joy of Missing Out. I want to welcome you to the JOMO(cast), a brand-new podcast for founders and creators seeking joy in a digital age.

JOMO is the joy of missing out on the right things, life-taking things like toxic hustle, comparison, disconnection, and digital drain, in order to make space for life-giving commitments that bring us peace, love, meaning, and joy. 

INTRO

I am still riding an absolute high from the podcast launch party we hosted here in Toronto, co-hosted with Artery, and today we're going to be hearing from the co-founder of Artery. Artery is a startup that you can kind of describe as Airbnb meets Eventbrite. People list their spaces, and it could be a living room or a back patio or a loft or any kind of space, and matches people, the hosts, with performers to create these intimate showcases, these intimate shows in people's homes and unusual spaces. And their tagline is “Every space is a stage.” And they were the perfect partner for the JOMO(cast) launch party to celebrate things joyfully. We had an incredible experimental cello duo called the VC2 play, and everyone that was in the room that evening, that room was bursting with people, described what a joyful experience it was, and it was truly a joyful experience for me. 

It's incredible what Salimah and her co-founder Vladic have created in Artery. It is a very unusual tech startup in the sense that their goal with their company is to reduce loneliness and increase greater offline connection - people gathering in real time and space.

So I hope you enjoy this conversation with me and Salimah about reducing loneliness and increasing joy in a digital age.

INTERVIEW

Christina:

Can you properly tell me how to say your last name? I say Abrahim; is it Ebraheem? 

Salimah:

So I say Salimah, EEbraheem. It's interesting about my last name. Uh, it's spelled E B R A H I M. Um, and it's really helped me navigate borders in an interesting way, just for that reason. Abraham with an A or Ebraham with an A is traditionally Jewish, and I is Muslim.

So I literally would walk through borders, going into Jerusalem or Israel from Palestine and just say, you know, they say, “What is this?” And I'd say “E, it's neutral.” And they would say, “Okay.” And they would let me in. So it's, it's a, yeah, it's a question I feel really calm about cause I'm like, I'm going to get through the border when you asked me that. So 

Christina:

That's amazing. 

Salimah:

So, uh, on certain days, it, uh, it'll be what it needs to be. 

Christina:

So Salimah, as you know, I have been on this quest to amplify the conversation around how to live well with technology. And you are in such an interesting space because you are the co-founder of a startup. You were co-founder of a tech company, um, by way of journalism by way of community building and activism. So you're a really unique person in this space. And I think the conversation I'm hoping to have with you today is about, um, why building trust in communities is important to you and sort of… But to begin really where the Artery story began for you personally.

Salimah:

Um, great. It's wonderful to be here, Christina. Um, you know, I've, it's, since the first day we met, um, that has resonated with me sort of your mission around this. And certainly as we have been building Artery, and we'll get into that later, um, the importance of that has become clearer and clearer. Um, for me, um, Artery Artery began several years ago when I was in grad school. Um, I'm, I'm a journalist. Um, I worked as a journalist, mostly in the Middle East and Africa and also covered a lot of US presidential politics. Um, and I met my co-founder in grad school, and he was a journalist, and we talked a lot about our experiences. As you would do.

And, uh, we shared our experiences: his mostly as a journalist in Russia and the South Caucasus, mine, uh, in the Middle East, as I mentioned. Um, and we also talked about how hard writing about culture and another culture can be, um, writing about culture. Isn't just writing about, you know, the musician or the artist. Culture is about the room we're in, um, how people enter, where they sit, how they, you know, greet their friends, how they joke, uh, with their neighbor.

Um, and often I think through both of our careers, you know, we realized that seeing the small stuff up close is the only way to understand the really big stuff. And it was out of that conversation of creating a platform that would connect people to the local culture and communities of a place, um, that the idea of, of Artery was born.

Um, I think for me, it had… that conversation that I ended up having with my co-founder Vladic, um, we started in 2012, um, really began for me. Uh, I think I, I found myself at grad school. I found myself having this year of a bit of a crisis with my career, um, that had arisen from feeling disconnection, um, with, with, uh, this basic idea of just feeling like we are all increasingly disconnected um, even though we have all this information and all this connectivity connecting us and where that personally struck for me was, you know, I had moved to the Middle East when I was, you know, right after university. I was 21 years old, got a bag, landed in Cairo and my whole intention, especially that was right around the Iraq war, just after 9-11, there was so much misunderstanding and even this perceived clash of civilizations. Um, and it just seemed to me like a caricature of, of two sides. Um, and my whole mission, uh, was, I think many journalists and writers share this, was to travel and to write about the other so that you could see the other.

Um, and that was really, really critical. And after about a decade of trying to do that, when you're over there and you're over in Damascus, you're over in Cairo or you're over in Aman. Um, you, you know that you're putting out a volume of information together with other journalists and you hope that people are reading.

Um, and you hope that that, that other is being seen. You don't need to like the individual I'm writing about in Jordan, but it's important that you see them and vice versa. And I think when I, um, when I came sort of came back and was, full-time sort of back in New York at that point, um, I realized that that threshold wasn't being met and that in this sort of decade, between 9-11 and sort of 2011, it was then, um, I thought we, we don't really know more about who a Syrian is, who an Iraqi is, um, what they care about, what they eat, what their culture is.

And it sort of hit me that all, if we don't, if, if we can't see someone for who they are and see them as ourselves and have that type of empathy, that no amount of information about the Threats they're under, or the insecurity in their region will move us to act and the cycle continues. And so I had a real crisis, um, around, around 20, you know, growing into 2011, um, where, yeah, I felt here I was a young journalist and because I had by lines from what people in Washington or Toronto would consider exotic places, my stock was rising and yet I felt a decade on that Um, we weren't moving that forward and, um, And so that's, that's when some of the conversations began. When I, when I stopped, um, to think about what actually connects us. 

Christina:

Was there a sense at any point that you were sort of shouting into the ether that the internet had sort of created a space where there was too much information, like you were saying you were, you were hoping that people were reading what you were putting out into the world, but You know, it it's so amplified. And so I think what I hear you saying is that you are really reflecting on the power of a single story.

Salimah:

Yeah, you know, I think it's interesting because the media landscape, even from when I was sort of beginning as a journalist in, in foreign correspondency and sort of, 03-04. You know, this is like, uh, pre mobile, right? Um, the internet, um, was still a hybrid part of our lives. Right. And, and, and not, not, not the sort of half of ourselves that it feels like it is today. And, um, there still was, you know, a few papers, everyone read a few, um, cable news stations and all that had You know, that that could be problematic also in, in other ways, um, because there was only a certain number of voices that were telling the story, we all seem to have a similar set of facts. And because there was, you know, you'd read the paper or you listen to six o'clock news, you'd get a digest, uh, of a bit of everything.

And, and I think what happened was, you know, in the last decade, last 15 years, there’s actually been, um, uh, almost a Renaissance of information. Like we have more quality documentaries, you know, long form books than we ever… blogs, uh, you know, informative tweets. And I say that at a time when, you know, uh, there's a lot of uninformative tweets, um, out there, but, um, a lot of great content.

And so the problem was never content, but, um, yeah, I think, I think two things, I think the, the balkanization of the media. Um, I think the fact that there was noise, I think the fact that people were now going in and, you know, you could, you could literally go through and try to figure out what you wanted to know in the news and be ignorant to everything else.

All of these things were really overwhelming, and You know, again, I think there's something even deeper than just content is that you need to spend time with your neighbor. Um, you need to spend time in your community. You need to spend time with people, uh, to, to have that type of curiosity, that kind of trust, um, muscle.

And, um, 

Christina:

and I would also add to that, just that we need Those relationships to make meaning, to make sense of the information that we're receiving. 

Salimah:

Absolutely. And, and I, you know, I don't jump the gun on this, but that's, that's something really that, um, has sort of catalyzed and really energized, um, the work-around Artery, especially in the last year, even more so as, as we started piloting.

Christina:

so bring us back to 2011 and that sort of crisis point, like where did this all begin for you? I mean, you've already taken us through part of the story, but then so you're in grad school. You're with Vlad, 

Salimah:

Vlad and a bunch of other sort of, um, you know, journalists that had been in the field, you know, ranging ages from sort of late twenties to kind of mid-forties. Uh, so really interesting. Yeah. 

Christina:

And set the scene: you're at what school you're studying, what? Just kind of paint a picture for us. 

Salimah:

Um, I’m at, uh, Columbia university and, you know, I had, um, just, uh, you know, before journalism, I had, um, been involved in building an environmental movement and environmental nonprofits sort of from my teens, um, that overlapped with my journalism career, but it was over a decade kind of into my twenties.

Christina:

As most teens do. (laughter)

Salimah:

Well, you know, this is the thing it started out as a letter writing campaign, right. That we thought was gonna last a few months. Uh, and we sort of around the kids for saving earth club and trying to write letters in our backyard and all of a sudden one step led to another. And, uh, we certainly did not expect that we would start with, we started in my colleague Simon’s basement over burgers and chocolate cake.

Christina:

Simon?

Salimah:

Jackson, uh, trying to save the, you know, trying to think about how we would write a letter or create a letter writing campaign to save BC Spirit Bear. And if you would of told us then when we were teens, that it would turn over a decade into like a 6-million-member network and 64 countries- And we saved the Spirit Bear- 

Christina:

My daughter just joined the Earth Rangers, 

Salimah:

She did? 

Christina:

Today.

Salimah:

Today?! 

Christina:

On the internet. She just she's found about the Earth Rangers, and you can sign up and sort of create, you know, I sign on to this commitment to learn more about nature and to support our environment and all of these things.

So I can't wait to tell her about you and the Spirit Bear. It starts with something small. 

Salimah:

I think Safeway, which was a, you know, uh, obviously grocery chain that was really big in BC. Um, they had kids for saving earth club that I first heard about when I was 11 years old and joined that. And we did, we cleaned up some parks.

Exactly. That. that's what it looks like. Um, and, and that's what it looks like through all of the, even as it scales, it's about those individual actions and finding a place to start. So I'll say with, with, you know, Being, and having had a background as an activist, and then knowing that I always wanted to see the world through a writer's lens or a journalist lens, when I hit this sort of crisis point in 2011, I thought, you know, um, obviously there's a medium and longer-term view towards writing.

Um, and it's critical. And I, so many colleagues, um, who have spent, uh, you know, decades and huge sacrifices telling the story. And so, um, I was never conflicted about the role of journalism, but I thought, you know, I have a, I have a few other skills too. Um, maybe I go work at the UN, maybe I go work at the IRC, like it's, to me, it seemed very critical, um, and very Just devastating, actually, that I was here with seeing my stock rising as a journalist. And I was writing about people who I thought seemed less and less understood. 

So for me, Artery began at a very macro level, um, in a lot of ways. Uh, and so when Vladic, and I started talking it at the, you know, we were both actually in a science journalism program Uh, at the Columbia journalism school, he was working, um, very unlikely beginnings to Artery. Uh, one would think he was working on a big exploration at a big narrative, uh, science, uh, piece on whether fish feel pain and looking at cognitive animal behavior and understanding. And I was actually thinking, at that point Well, you know, I've got this environmental background and I've, uh, covered a lot of conflict. And so I was looking at the nexus of an environmental security, looking at environmental war and peace. And I thought I was coming to Columbia to, to have a bit of an exhale after being in the field and to work on the beginnings of a book around environmental security. And whether that led me in a journalism path or, or an activism path, um, was was totally open to that. 

Um, but it was, it was in that year when, uh, I didn't have any, uh, agenda or intention that I was surrounded by a lot of, um, friends and colleagues, uh, who happened to all be in New York at that time. And I love to cook and we had a lot of meals at my home and I just started talking about, um, you know, we started talking about our lives in these, in these places that we lived in.

And I started talking about, uh, the, the modern jazz scene in Cairo in Egypt. Uh, the hip hop scene in Beirut, um, you know, Aman's poetry scene. And that's really where, uh, I realized that, wow, in those moments, like really smart well-traveled people and some who hadn't traveled that much. Um, but who sort of had a sense of the world I could see were even surprised by that.

And, um, it was amazing because I thought in that moment about talking about modern jazz in Cairo, uh, more, more sort of ended up happening around that feeling of, you know, wanting, of seeing the other than almost in anything I'd ever written. I felt that. and it was this huge kind of like over the head of course, culture is, is always the powerful lens through which we see each other.

I don't need to know about a region or a context or history, but if I connect with a piece of music or a play or an idea, I'm connected to you. Um, and, um, and so, yeah, that's how, that's how those two things coming together led us to, um, yeah quit our jobs and build Artery. 

Christina:

Incredible. That is such an incredible story. So, um, I remember probably almost a year ago Now, having a conversation with you, where we were talking about technology, and we can talk often about the ways that it disconnect us, connects us, the ways that it isolates us, but you and I had this incredible conversation about the ways in which the internet has you know, sort of unexpectedly created these trusting communities, you know, even five years ago, it would have been, um, maybe terrifying even to get into the back of a stranger's car. It would have been strange to go and stay in a stranger's home. And yet through things like Airbnb and Lyft and Uber, this has become commonplace, and it has actually started to sort of weave these new webs of trust within communities.

And I think that that is a huge value to what the internet has done for us. And I, and I know that you're sort of wanting to build on that. You are already in so many different countries and communities through Artery. Can you kind of take us into that story? 

Salimah:

Yeah, I think it's, it's such a, you know, I think sometimes, you know, when you're, We're in a process of such transformative change. And I, I think we look often to, uh, what's happening technologically around us. We look specifically at the technology, I think what's really interested me is the sort of normative shifts that are happening, which is, which is what you're talking about. Um, and you know, I think right now, because we're in the early days of Take the sharing economy. Um, you know, there are, there are, you know, imperfect expressions of that. And there, there are challenges, you know, for any of these companies and whether you like Airbnb or Lyft or Uber as companies, that to me is separate from the story because the, the shift that they're engendering around exactly that, um, Five six, seven years ago, the idea of getting into a stranger's car or staying in a stranger's home, um, was not only not there, but it was, it was crazy.

And today it's, um, in some ways aspirational and that shift is more powerful than any one company, um, and each, uh, you know, sort of each sort of, um, year that goes by with these new types of opportunities to trust each other in different ways, I think allows for so much more. And, and I, and I really look at, um, you know, something like Artery, could not exist, um, without, uh, the cultures of Kickstarter or Airbnb or Lyft or any of those.

Um, and I, and this is where I think it's really interesting is that what… This is the moment we're in where understanding that, um, what is the responsibility of the architects of the sharing economy, um, and of these trusting communities? Um, but then also really to ask ourselves a really interesting question, um, aside from, you know, booking a car or staying in accommodation, what else does this allow for?

What else does this trust allow for? Um, and that's where I get really, really excited. Um, and if, if you actually, so let me connect it back to what we were just saying before, you know, when we began Artery, um, which is essentially a platform that lets anyone open up their living room, their backyard, the rooftop to, um, an intimate cultural experience that anyone can attend That's the basic idea. 

I got really excited about, um, you know, Artery Beirut existing in the same community as Artery Toronto and Artery Baghdad and New York, for all the reasons we just discussed. what has been Amazing to me this last year, piloting Artery this last year and a half, and specifically in Toronto has been, um, within a city, you know, take Dufferin Grove or you're in the junction, or you're in Scarborough, Scarborough doesn't necessarily know Scarborough.

You know, we, we know our neighbors on our street likely. Um, but these days, we don't know the people on the street, one street over or two streets over. And I think that there has been a, um, at the same time we've had the rise of these online sort of online to offline trusting communities. We've had a lot of the existing communities, um, that we've relied on, uh, places of worship libraries, community centers, um, not become less relevant in our lives because the library, I, you know, I will fight for that til the end um, that's really important place, but they have, they have, um, other things have overtaken, uh, those, and so that social infrastructure we've relied on for generations is becoming less and less central to us just going through the process of our daily lives.

Right. Um, and I think what has been really interesting for us has been learning that in trying to underst… I'm now seeing people walk into, into their neighbors' homes, into their neighbor, homes in their neighborhood that they never would have walked into because of Artery. And what I'm realizing is that's like an awakening, a muscle that is not gone, but has atrophied greatly because we haven't had to use it as much in the last decade around curiosity and trust in our neighbors. 

And, you know, I realized that if you want someone to sort of bringing it full circle for me, if you. You know, we're busy. There's a lot of information in the world thinking about what to care about is overwhelming, but, um, the only way you can really inspire someone to care or, and think deeply, or be curious about what's going on in Damascus with someone else is if that muscle is alive and, uh, working and being exercised here.

So I actually see You know, people going into strangers’ homes, these trusting communities, certainly through what we do with the Artery as sort of allowing us to build that muscle and that curiosity and trust. And what I'm excited for is that, what does that then allow for when you're confronted with people Not just two streets away or, you know, in another city or another country? Um, and I really see that connection now. Um, so it's seeing it less as being a content thing than actually the way we understand the world is the way we live our lives locally.

Christina:

I think there's something so powerful, and I know, you know this because of exactly what you're creating, in entering someone else's personal space. I went into a friend’s living room the other day, just for a few minutes, because I was picking my kid up and just being in her living room, I actually said it out loud, just standing inside her space.

I just commented to her, you know, I need to spend more time in people's homes. I've gotten into a habit of meeting people, you know, for coffee at a public space. But when you walk into someone's room and I did this when I came to your first Artery showcase that I ever attended um, the first thing that I do is I look at people's books, right?

Salimah:

Me too.

Christina:

You look at the books and it tells you a story. I'm looking over at the bookshelves in this exact room.

Salimah: 

I’m looking at your books right now, Christina. 

Christina:

I know, right. You can see all of my husband's science-fiction, um, I've embraced it slowly over time. Yeah, I think, um, one of the assumptions that I realize I'm trying to confront with this joy of missing out conversation is three assumptions.

The first is that more is better. That faster is better. And what is the last one more is better, faster is better. And new is better, you know, new, faster, better. And those are these primary promises A lot of the time from advertising, from the technology space in particular, you know, we're constantly trying to move fast, or we think about companies like Amazon, like how, how much quicker can we get this product to your door?

Um, you know, all of these things, but when I think about what is necessary to build really meaningful relationships? I think in the opposite direction, I think less is better. Slower is better. And I think what you're creating with Artery is an invitation for people to slow and to Build sort of this very intimate web in their local community.

I love what you said about, you know, Scarborough doesn't know Scarborough, you know, Toronto doesn't know Toronto. I think it's true that some of us know our neighbors, you know, living in a community, uh, as tightly packed as I do, we, you know, are almost forced to connect with our neighbor because they're literally standing right there.

But if you go into more suburban communities, you know, people are far more spaced out. People live in towers. Even though they want to know their neighbors. It's very difficult because people are on different schedules. And so, um, yeah, I would love for you to just explain to us what happens when someone goes to Artery to the website and like what, and walk us through that process.

Salimah: 

Yeah. Uh, so, you know, to all of those things, um, I think that's, you know, what you said that last point that, you know, was that new is not always better. Um, Artery is based on a really, really old idea, right? The idea of culture in private spaces of community in private spaces, um, is, is as old as culture itself, right.

Um, Beethoven, uh, would recognize an Artery showcase more than he would some of these, um, venue, uh, events, um, chamber music came out of bedrooms. You think about Harlem rent parties, right? And the 1920s. And you think about Parisian salons, this Impulse to connect in intimate ways um, just where we live is, uh, is a very human impulse.

And so I always say that what we're doing with Artery is not anything new, you know, this, this has existed and this does exist in every city and town in the world today in some way. So I just want it to be really clear about that. And so. You know, when, when people say, “Oh, this is a bit of a revolution in how people are going to connect.” And, um, I'll get into the process of it. I always come back and say, “it's very much a counter revolution.” Um, and that, that gets me really excited, um, because we're using technology and online tool to allow people to connect to something, uh, that humans have always done, um, and to connect to people offline because the majority of the Artery experience doesn't happen online, it all happens offline. 

Um, so with Artery, uh, they're sort of. Three groups. Um, you can come into Artery as a performer, uh, someone who wants to showcase or exhibit something, and it could be anyone from an author to a comedian, to a poet, to a singer. We've had a scientist recently. Uh, talking about ideas like black holes and, uh, astrophysics, uh, in living rooms.

And then there are hosts on Artery and hosts Are anyone with a space. Um, it could be your living room, my backyard, a rooftop we've had…

Christina:

Salimah’s bathroom. 

Salimah: 

Oh, we have had an opera in my bathroom. Um, that'll be another podcast or we can go into that later. Um, so we've had yeah, everything the size of, uh, you know, dorm rooms to castles on Artery and, and, uh, really the space, uh, the experience fits into the space.

Um, and then there's the audience, um, and that is. You know, all of us. I hope all of you listening to begin with who can go on to Artery and discover the showcases that come out of, um, performers and hosts, connecting. and Artery showcases are uh, you know, above all intimate, they're intimate experiences.

These aren't 150-hundred-person, 200 person shows. Um, they're usually, you know, 15 to kind of 40 people, usually about 20, 25 people is a great number for an Artery because living rooms, you know, most of us don't have living rooms that can fit 60 people in there, like, you know, um, and so, uh, they, um, yeah, so that's the basic idea.

And so you can go into Artery and, um, you can grab a spot to a showcase. There are public and private showcases and for the public showcases, you can RSVP limited spots. And when you RSVP, you will, uh, get the address on RSVP. No addresses are public. And get, yeah, uh, sort of a note from the host saying this is my address and anything particular to their location. and this is what people find really astounding, um, is that like all of a sudden you get this address and now you knock on someone's door and they invite you in and.

It's it's. I think we feel that when we visit friends, we haven't seen in a long time, like you said, like it's, it's amazing to be in their home because it feels there's a generosity, there’s an intimacy that you have with that person. And when you do it with a stranger, now you bring in trust. Um, and so.

Actually, if you have a little bit of anxiety, if you've never walked into a stranger's home through one of these showcases, and you're listening, thinking about your first Artery, that anxiety you might have about “Wait, I'm going into a stranger's home?” That actually is, is what eventually creates the magic because, um, you have to sort of lean in halfway and, and the and the host and the audience lean in halfway.

So all these showcases feel very different than events, because they are co-creation. if I'm opening on my doors with trust in generosity and you were showing up in my home with that same type of trust and generosity and an artist or a speaker is coming in and from two feet away sharing their gift, that is all a co-creation.

Um, and so, you, you remove one element out of that and you don't have the showcase. And I think that's, um, I think in, in specifically culture, especially over the last many decades, we've gotten to this consumer/producer model that culture's produced over here and you're invited to consume it across an orchestra pit or a stage, and it, it can be quite costly and it's largely centralized in downtown communities. 

Um, and so where, where I get really excited with Artery is that no, it's, culture is where you live. Culture is on your street. And I don't just say that based on the fact that we want to bring it there. I actually believe so much of the creative life of our cities is invisible because it's happening in our neighborhoods and it's happening in our communities outside, even the downtown core. Um, but there's just been no way to easily surface that and discover that and even offer, you know, your home for that. Um, and so that's, that's what I get really excited.

And so, yeah. You know, when people enter people's homes, I think what happens is that you, you genuinely leave with connection. Um, and you, um, there's a, there's a, there's a gratefulness there that I find, uh, or a gratitude that is part of the process that is not typically part of the way we consume culture now.

And it has let us, you know, let us be less creative, less experimental. Um, yeah. And, you know, you made a really, you brought up a really good point about how difficult it is. Um, and I think people want to connect in these ways with each other, but, you know, after you graduate university or you're in a job or you've got kids or your, um, your kids have, you know, moved out and you're an empty nester, um, how, how do you connect and have these social bonds and discover this stuff is actually really challenging.

And I think one of the really. Interesting things. When someone, when you enter someone's home, you're not just entering a home for performance, you are stepping into their life for that moment. And even when you were with your friend, you know, you can know me, but when you're in my home, uh, you, you can have a sense of, of my life and my values and what I care about.

Um, and I think increasingly with technology, especially to sort of bring it back to this idea that we're more connected than we've ever been online, but we're increasingly isolated from each other in real life to dangerous degrees. I mean, the loneliness is an epidemic and. Getting out of our cultural bubbles, both, both addressing loneliness and social isolation, which is a huge problem. The UK, you know, alone has just introduced a minister of loneliness and there were studies that loneliness will, um, will be a higher threat to public health than obesity or, um, uh, heart disease, uh, over the coming years. Um, that, that is certainly something, um, that I think we have to really sit back and think as a society.

On the other side of that, the, one of the consequences we can see of being on these social networks is the algorithms and is how they are pushing us further into our own cultural bubbles. And so you can be on the internet all day and never be around any community that thinks differently than you, or that it has different experiences than you, or has different demographics, racial, or socioeconomic backgrounds in you.

And the consequences of us, I think not being able to break out of that cultural bubble are, um, a rise in… we see it all around us. I think we see it in our politics being calcified. Um, and so it's really, really critical. And so for me, thinking about ways. Um, and whether you come at this as a writer, as an educator, as someone building what we're like, we're building an Artery, trying to figure out ways where people have the opportunity To be in a room with people they would not necessarily always be in a room with, because I can argue with you on Facebook, and we can yell at each other, but if we're sitting in real life and we're sharing an experience together, and then we disagree. I mean, I begin with the principle that you're human and, um, and I remember that so.

Then I'm then I'm, I'm showing up to that conversation in a totally different way. I'm not being anonymized. Um, and so you can't replace the physical connection. And understanding, I know this is something like, this is your life's work as well. 

Christina:

I'm just sitting here nodding and just making big doughy eyes at Salimah, just yes, yes, yes. Yeah. I mean the empathy, right? I mean, it comes back to that always about what it means to be human and the fact that from infancy, we're seeking out the eyes of other human beings too. Right. It's like mirroring and building out. What it means to be human in the ways that we relate to one another.

So when we remove that intimacy, when we remove that connection, it allows for a lot of ugliness, and we see it online. And so, you know, it's kind of the great meme of, um, celebrities reading mean tweets, right? Is, would you say this to my face? The truth is a 99.9% of people would never do that. And so I love How you're bringing your journalistic conflict zone background into this discussion because in Canada I think at least in my environment, you know, we're quite peaceful, but I know that in America, obviously this is a huge discussion in terms of the polarization between people. 

Salimah: 

I think, yes, obviously as a Canadian, I'm proud of so much of what happens is in, in, in our country around dialogue, around understanding, but there's a lot of misunderstanding here. And the fact of the matter is, is that even in my daily life in, you know, for example, you know, when I'm in Toronto, yeah, I'm still in my cultural bubble. And you know, how often am I, you know, being based in the West end of Toronto, how often am I in Scarborough or Mississauga in someone's home?

We, we see that, I think in our own politics here in our, in our mayoral politics, right between the city and the suburbs. So I think, um, all of those things are happening at every level. 

Christina:

My immediate thought is: It already feels like a risk for me to go into a stranger's house within my own neighborhood.

Yeah. What would I be willing to like, would I be willing to risk going to somewhere so far outside of my own experience? Like Scarborough, for example, not to harsh on Scarborough, but we love you. Scarby but… 

Salimah:

Oh my God, I love love Scarborough. There's so many good people my way through Scarborough. 

Christina:

That ask of almost of ourselves to not just get out of our comfort zone and say no to watching Netflix for yet another night by going into our local community, but then taking it a step further into, would we go, you know, in Toronto, you know, the joke of like the East versus West, right?

Like, would I be willing to go all the way to the East end, um, to experience something completely different. I think this is also where we can lean into our current friendships and relationships. You know, I can imagine going to my first Artery showcase and bringing a friend. Right. And that's a beautiful thing, right? There's not, there's nothing wrong, Wrong about bringing like a little comfort blanket, a little… 

Salimah:

People bring their communities. Yeah. 

Christina:

Yeah, no. I mean, um, and marriages, like people are hooking up. Like people, like relationships are starting through Artery, and I shouldn't say “hookup”, relationships, of all kinds.

Salimah:

People are finding friendships, people are, there are people dating on Artery. Um, some long-term relationships have emerged. We're waiting for the first Artery uh, wedding or whatever type of celebration they want. Um, and yeah, I, again, I think it's, it's not, uh, … ingredient. 

It's like, we, again, if, if there's around a shared experience, if you're able to spend some time with an intimate group of people, um. but I do think it's really difficult.

Like even if we were to, you know, you come home on Thursday night and you're tired and, um, you know, it's cold and yes, you want to connect with you know, the other outer boroughs and you want to connect with the outer neighborhoods. Um, but how do you do that? And I think that puts a lot of pressure on all of us to kind of be sort of these like, you know, superheroes.

And that's asking a lot too like, and I, and I kind of realized it with my journalism, like asking someone to like, understand all about the world or asking them to know about an issue or the consequences of the war in Iraq. Like everyone is dealing with a lot in their own lives. So yeah, the way I look at it, if you can offer someone You know, a small, shared experience that lasts 60 to 90 minutes that may even be in their own neighborhood. Um, that's a place to start. 

Um, and I guess, you know, I'm also, you know, of the belief that, you know, what has come before us allows for now to exist. And I'm really excited about beyond Artery. Um, If, you know, a thousand people in one neighborhood end up over that year in each other's homes in any sort of arrangement, what else does that allow for in terms of that community and organizing and civic engagement?

So, you know, I, um, I remember, uh, talking to when, uh, we were building the spirit bear youth coalition and the environmental movement, and we were very lucky enough to Um, have, uh, Dr. Jane Goodall as a mentor. And I remember, you know, years in because you begin something and then you're in the middle, um, and it's very hard and up and down sort of looked the same. And I remember asking her like, you know, “It seems so large, like it seems so overwhelming the challenges that exist in the world. Um, what is your advice?” And her advice was really simple and clear and came in a minute and, uh, she says, “Just find your piece in it.” Start somewhere down your street, Earth Rangers, great place to start, find your piece in it.

And I think we can get, and I can get, believe me, I can get paralyzed as well. Um, And I, and I think that's, that's, I love your, your expression of it as an invitation. I just think we just need more invitations like JOMO like Artery, um, out there.

Christina:

Amazing. Um, I asked Salimah to bring the Artery bell and I want her to play it for us now. So can you explain to us what this is and how it is, how it, how it functions within your community? 

Salimah:

Yeah. So, um, you know, people are gathering in homes and some people have hosted or used to hosting people and some aren't. And we realized that first moment where you, people are in your home, and you want to begin the performance or the lecture or the show, um, can be sort of awkward for people.

And, uh, we thought a lovely way for a host to sort of bring people's attention was through a bell. and it started as that, and the community loves it. And, um, and, uh, so it's now, um, it's now become part of the beginnings of an Artery. So I will play this bell with the caveat that those who aren't musicians build platforms for those who can build musicians for musicians.

So, this is the Artery bell.

Tada.

And, um, you know, what's, what's interesting, what’s really exciting to see is that even amongst, you know, we have, we began in sort of piloting in Toronto, communities started also growing in New York. Those are our two pilot cities. But Artery communities have been growing in 12 other cities from Reykjavik to small community in Spain to Washington, to Vancouver, to Montreal, to Ottawa.

We've had invite requests from 35 countries. And what's neat is that when you come together with similar values around intimacy, around sharing experience, um, you can actually introduce some shared traditions amongst a community that lives around the world. So I sort of see this as a shared tradition.

Um, and it's kind of fun just to hammer on a bell, isn't it? 

Christina:

Absolutely. And the one I went to at your place, uh, the youngest audience member who may have been about five or six, four, he had this bell and he, you should have just seen the look on this kid's face, just the power that he held in his hand. And just that small little person was able to gather an entire apartment full of people. 

Salimah:

Yeah, his, his name was Van and, um, he's actually approached me about, um, co-hosting His first Artery. So he'll be the youngest co-host of an Artery. He came to the performance that you came to. My living room was Julie Nesrallah. CBC was doing an opera in my living room to about 30 people and a Van attended half of that, which is pretty good for four-year-old. 

Christina: 

He ate a lot of oranges.

Salimah: 

Yep. And since, um, his mum has sort of put him in touch and, uh, via voice notes on, uh, texting and he's, um, he's going to be hosting a showcase for his community. And I'm happy to help him and he'll have a bell. 

Christina:

I love it. 

Salimah:

So every host gets a bell, uh, when they, when they join Artery and they do their first Artery.

Christina:

It's incredible. I have two questions for you, please. The first is JOMO to you means missing out on what? JOMO means missing out on… 

Salimah:

JOMO means removing FOMO. Yeah. To me, like that's the first thing that comes in is that, you know, when you're so connected online and like a thousand things are happening on Instagram and Facebook and constantly, you just, JOMO means presence. Like to me, I'm gonna not fit it in, but like being joyful about where you are. And of course you're going to be missing out on something else, but that's the nature of being present. 

Christina:

Absolutely. You have to miss out on something to embrace something else. Yeah. And lastly, Salimah, I want you to finish the sentence: I want to find more joy in… 

Salimah:

The middle, the process. Um, I think, there's this quote that I recently heard by Rosabeth Moss Kanter, she was a professor at Harvard, and this is quote just sort of resonated with me. It said, “In the middle, everything feels like failure.” Um, and that can apply to so many aspects of our lives and certainly our work.

And I think that's also where the joy is. You know, everyone loves the happy, you know, the exciting beginning and we're all in love with a happy ending, but the middle is where we lean into each other with trust. The middle is where, when we, we fall, um, the people who love us are there to hold us. The middle is the middle is the good stuff 

Christina:

It is the good stuff. Thank you so much for being with me today. 

Salimah:

Thank you, Christina. Always.